Hello, and thanks for joining us for another episode of Mid American gardener.

I'm your host Tinisha Spain.

And joining me in the studio today is one of our master gardeners, Sara Vogel, and she's going to tell you a little bit about herself and where you can find her in the garden.

So, Sarah, Hi.

Thanks for having me.

Yes.

Yeah.

So I was, I'm the Horticulture Educator for DeWitt Macon and Piatt counties.

And I was hoping to come on and talk a little bit today about fall planting a tree planting trees and fall and the benefits that that can have over spring and summer planting.

It's hard to believe we're talking about fall already.

I'm a little bit upset about that.

I mean, it is August.

What makes sense, but this summer seems like it just went really quick.

Yeah, in a flash was in and it was wacky to weather wise, did you have a lot of folks dealing with a lot of different plant issues over the summer?

We did, we did.

You know, oftentimes, we deal with some drought issues in the summer, so we're not getting adequate rainfall that can cause a lot of stress on plants, and especially our trees.

And then we get a lot of rainfall all at once.

And then so insect and disease, Paul, populations go way up.

So yeah, we did, we did we always get a lot of questions, both myself and the master gardeners in our unit, get a lot of questions around trees.

And for good reason, you know, trees are really valuable in the landscape, you know, people have spent their time and their money, their resources, you know, if you have to hire somebody to go out and plant these trees, so they are really valuable assets or elements in any landscape.

And because of that, you know, they're so valuable that we want to make sure, you know, we're considering all those really healthy practices like proper species selection, proper installation, proper, proper maintenance, afterwards.

So you can really achieve that success with your tree.

And we get a lot of questions on the show about trees that were perhaps planted and not the best spot for someone's yard or a tree that's become diseased or so we do get a lot of questions about that, whether it provides enough shade or too much shade, or this tree got way bigger than I thought it was going to so but you're saying a lot of those things, those problems can be kind of taken care of on the front end, if you just do the research and kind of figure out what fits in your landscape or what you would like in your landscape.

That's right.

That's right, yeah, to take in some of those.

That's kind of our site preparation that we do before we select our species.

So you know, oftentimes, homeowners or gardeners can have a tree species in mind that they want to plant, but it may not be suitable or conducive to those site conditions.

You know, like, Well, my, my grandma always really loved cherry trees.

And I'd like to plant a cherry tree, but your yard is a swamp with poorly drained soils.

I'm here to tell you cherry trees don't like wet, probably you may see a little bit of tree decline or even failure in that kind of site.

So we want to let our site conditions really dictate what species we select, and go at it that way instead of picking the species first.

Gotcha.

Okay, well, so you've got a lot of great information to share about tree planting today.

So I'm just gonna turn it on over to you.

And sure, yeah, so take it away.

Exactly.

Some of the some of the benefits of planting and fall is that we get some we don't have those hot temperatures this summer.

So yes, you know, there may be a little bit more selection in the springtime, a little, a few more species to choose from.

But there are in the fall, there are plenty of vendors and organizations that have especially native species for sale.

So it's something to look into.

So we get adequate rainfall in the fall, where in spring, we may have plenty of rainfall, but then we quickly turn around into into drought conditions.

So in the in the fall, you kind of you know, reduce it have a reduced risk of drought.

You also have cooler temperatures.

So again in the spring that heats right up into summer, where you're going to have a little more pests and disease issues, or insect infestations.

We're in fault, this soil temperatures, our temperatures are still warm enough to encourage root growth, but they're not so high that it's causing the tree to become dehydrated or desiccated.

So it doesn't want as or doesn't require as much moisture.

And then another really good benefit to planting in the fall is that you know, you install the tree hopefully with proper methods and then that soil has a little chance to settle over the winter.

And the roots while the when the temperature does get warm enough in the soil, those roots can still grow so you kind of get into jump start on Route establishment for the next year.

So if you are sort of beginning your search, because this may have pique someone's interest out there, what's your first step?

What's your first step when you're considering putting a tree in your landscape?

Right?

So as I mentioned, your site considerations your site preparation.

So first of all, you know, something that people might overlook is your light exposure.

So do you have is most of your yard already dense shade or in your neighborhood is there already a lot of shade, you might want to get a species that is shade tolerant, because if you don't, there's not going to be enough light present, for whatever you choose that maybe shade intolerant.

Really, a big factor is your soil, you want to know your soils.

In fact, I would encourage everybody to do a soil test before they put in or choose their species, you want to know not only the nutrient concentrations of your soils, and what what nutrients are present there, and how much of each, but also the pH, the pH of the soil is going to make a huge difference in what you can plant there.

And then what other you know the drainage of your soils, that's going to be a big factor?

Are they very dense clay soils, are they you know, well silty, well draining soils, that's going to play a huge factor, some trees can tolerate a little more swampy conditions than others.

And then kind of another thing is we want our yards to work for our benefit, right, we want them to be functional.

So you kind of want to plan out what you want your yard to look like.

You might take into consideration any utility lines that are over overhead, because as you mentioned, when monetary gets to its mature size, you might have a great big limb hanging over the house, or then you have to prune it off and make a big wound on the tree.

Or it grows so close to the house that you have to prune it back every year that's not really healthy for the tree.

So you want to take those considerations in mind utility lines, if you have, if you're thinking about planting on a corner lot or close to the road, you might consider your sight line like for you or anybody else coming down the road.

That's a huge thing.

If you've ever been in a four way stop, and somebody has a shrub on that corner, you know what I'm is exactly what I'm talking about.

So those are some of the things that go into your site preparation.

And then another thing is, you want to plant diversity, you want to think about what trees are already out there.

Maybe you already have three maple trees in your yard, probably branch out into another plant family that was a plant joke, by the way.

But yeah, so and then, as mentioned, these site conditions, and this site preparation really is what goes into how you're going to select your species.

Okay.

Now when you're out looking at a nursery, let's say you go the route of going and literally physically picking out your own trees, what are some things to look for when you're selecting them?

Right, so to get the individual tree, you know, go out there and shop for your individual tree, there's a few forms in which trees can be sold.

So you'll have bare root.

And all of those have their own pros and cons to each, you'll have bare root, which is just that it does not have a ball of soil around it.

Usually they're a little bit smaller, but they don't have as many roots to establish.

So you're kind of starting from ground zero there.

If you do get ball a bare root, you want to soak those roots for several hours, but not a whole day to ensure that they're well hydrated to be planted.

You can also get a bald and burlap tree, which is you know dug with the big tree spade.

And it comes with the whole ball of soil and usually only about like five to 10% of its roots.

So it's really important, you know, if a tree is taken out, taken away 95% of its roots, it goes into your yard, it's really important to establish those roots properly, then we can also get containerized trees where you get the whole root mass, but you have to be careful to look at that root mass maybe even washed the roots off to ensure that there aren't circling or girdling roots, maybe prune some back and prune some of those dead or broken or crossing or circling roots back.

So it kind of depends on what, you know, particular kind of tree you're going to buy.

But then, what is the tree look like?

Is there damage done to the stem?

If there's foliage on it?

Is it healthy looking foliage or is it you know, speckled in yellow?

If there's broken branches or codominant stems, it's something that we talk a lot about myself and my colleagues and those are, you know stems instead of having one straight central leader a tree will often develop to codominant stems, which isn't typically a problem until it starts to increase in diameter each of those stems and then they kind of grow into each other and that included bark in that crevice is a weak spot.

And so some trees are more notorious for that kind of growth pattern than others.

But really just trying to trying to find healthy stock that you can get.

And then as it just your average gardener, is it.

I know there are a lot of things that can go wrong that you can do wrong planting too shallow planting too deep.

But your average gardener is it?

Is it easy to plant your own trees?

Is it recommended?

You know, what are your thoughts there?

Because it seems like, for me anyway, that would be a little bit intimidating to be, you know, okay, I'm going to put this tree in, and you've worried about the depth and the health of the soil?

So is it something that your average gardener at home can do?

Yeah, you don't?

I think so.

I think it's not only like, rewarding to put that your own tree in the landscape.

But you get a little bit of physical exercise and, and if you're able to do it, I certainly encourage it.

Plus, if you do it, you can ensure that you're taking those proper methods as opposed to someone you might hire or whatever the case may be.

But yeah, there are a few things that can certainly help you along with those a few pieces of information.

As you mentioned, being planted too deeply.

That is a super common phenomenon, I guess you want to say trees just a few inches too deep, can have a lot of problems down the road, you can start to see early decline right after it's planted.

It can take trees are very patient.

So it can take 10 or 15 years for that deeply planted tree to really show full of bow.

Yeah, yeah, it could just kind of make it fail over time.

So that's a huge problem.

So even when you're getting like containerized and or ball and burlap trees, you want to make sure that you can see the root flare on the tree, that's really important.

And when once you put it in the ground, you want to be able to see the root flare, if you can't see the two biggest roots coming out of that tree in the first few inches of soil, then there's too much soil on tablet stem.

And so planting that hole nice and wide, but very shallow.

Okay, so one of the first things that we'd like to point out is that 90% of the absorbing roots on a tree are in the top 12 inches of soil.

Okay, so when we're preparing that whole, we want to make sure that it's a good supportive environment for those roots to expand and establish in there.

So you don't want it too deep.

In fact, I encourage planting just a little bit high, because it will settle.

You loosen up all the soil around there, but don't disturb the bottom.

So okay, I'm learning a lot today.

Yeah, that's, unfortunately, trees are my favorite thing to talk about.

And I get to talk about a lot.

You get paid for it.

Yeah, that works out and I live in the dream.

Now what are some common things that people can have go wrong?

I see on your slide, you've got transplant shock.

And then there's another thing I want to talk about.

A real Stickler, you guys always mentioned is piling up mulch overhead and looks like a volcano.

Right.

Let's talk a little bit about that.

Sure.

Yeah.

So the aftercare is the most important I think bit of it, well, they're all important your site prep your species selection, planting, but aftercare is really going to make or break that tree, even if you did everything else, right.

If you don't do proper aftercare, you may see some decline or failure.

Water, water water, because the first even few months while that tree is trying to establish roots, it can dry out in a day, some larger trees like B and B trees, they can dry out in a day, they can evaporate or transpire some of the moisture out of the leaves and suck it through the roots.

And it's just a constant process of drying out.

So you water a lot.

We do encourage mulching.

But you want to think bagel, not muffin.

That's what we say yes, with a hole in the middle.

So the multiple Kaino that we often refer to your right it's piled up against the stem.

And that can make a moist, dark damp environment where you'll start to see you know, maybe insect infestations or decay or rot of some kind.

So it's not really a positive thing to have that.

You want to spread it out.

I don't think there's any such thing as too wide a mulch ring.

You have to think tree's roots expand three to five times beyond where their canopy is.

So as big of altering as you like two to four inches deep, but keep it a few inches away from the stem.

Not the you said a bagel not of muffin Yes.

Bagel.

Not like that.

Yeah, I like that.

Yeah, remember that one.

And there's so many really great benefits to mulching.

You're not only retaining moisture, which is going to help the tree.

It's adding a little bit of organic matter back into the soil.

You have some weed suppression that you no no Light is getting to that turf grass or weeds around the tree.

And also you're gonna keep your mower deck away from it.

And I've seen the mower deck disease on many a tree.

Oh, yeah, just getting up next to it.

You don't think trees are really strong, you don't think you're going to damage it but certainly can be injured.

Interesting.

Okay, what else do we need to know about planting some fall trees?

Yeah, so you're right.

transplant shock is most certainly a thing that can happen.

It's to be expected, whether it's a tree going from the nursery into your yard, whether you're bringing in your house plants from the porch into your living room.

transplant shock is a thing that plants will experience when moving in location.

So making sure we're giving it that that adequate care the moisture, I would not suggest using any fertilizer when you plant a tree move might think that's going to help but oftentimes excessive fertilization not only can burn the tree and droughty conditions, but it will encourage shoot growth and not root growth.

So we want that root growth to really establish a healthy plant.

Also want to keep broadleaf herbicides away from your tree, you might think that you're just putting it on your lawn, but again, those roots go way out.

So you want to keep that away from your tree because what are deciduous trees?

They're broad leaves.

And yeah, wow.

Okay, we've got a couple of viewer questions for you to answer as well.

Did you have any other tree tips?

Well, probably a lot.

Yes.

Well, yeah, we think we could talk about this all day, right.

All right.

Now we've got some viewer questions for Sarah to answer.

This one is from Roberta rice.

She has a 16 year old Rhododendron wants to know when and how much to prune that for thicker foliage.

Okay, so there's a couple of ways you could go about that.

Some people would choose to cut it back right after it flowers, there's kind of again, pros and cons to both.

Some people would choose to let it flower in the spring and enjoy those beautiful blooms, and then cut it back right after that.

But you can't cut it back as hard.

So if you're trying to reshape it, you might also consider waiting until later in the year, and really cutting it back hard.

Maybe like 30% of it cut some of the bigger older stems out.

But as you do that, maybe you only take a little bit each year.

So that's kind of you severely cut it back.

But you want to do that over a few years.

So it might be kind of wacky looking for a few years.

Just turn the pot.

Yeah.

And then finally, hopefully come back.

What's going on is the the heading cuts that you're making, just trimming everything back.

Those are going to make more dense foliage.

Or if you cut back severely, like I mentioned, you'll get new suckers that will kind of grow back more evenly.

Gotcha.

Yeah.

And is that something you would do this time of year?

Wait a little bit later.

When would you start the the rhododendron, I think if you cut it back right after it blooms, that would be late spring, late spring.

But then the severe cuts I believe you can do in fall in the fall.

Okay, great advice.

All right, we're gonna go to number 41.

This is from Kathy and Pontiac.

33 years ago, I moved into my house and there was a very old Harry lowriders walking stick in the yard.

I cleaned a lot of dead wood out of it and it was beautiful for many years.

Each fall, I would trim the straight sticks out and save them to use for water fencing in my yard.

The last few years, some of the branches were dying.

And I tried to remove each as I could.

This spring it is not leafing out.

Some of the straight sticks are but very few of the curly ones.

I think it is dead and wonder if there's anything I can do now.

Should I cut it back?

Or am I going to lose this old friend?

I hate questions like this his people.

I am one of those people that get really attached to Yeah.

And when you start to see them declining, it's like phoning the experts and see if they can, right.

Yeah.

So that's the value that they have.

Right?

I really want this pretty Tria yard, literally sentimental, really valuable.

So judging from the pictures, it looks like you have some new growth low suckers coming up from there from the bottom.

And you also have the older kind of winding twisting stems as well.

Hairy ladders walking stick is typically a grafted plant.

So we what has been done is the curly part has been grafted on top of some more generic root stock of that coreless I believe.

And what can happen is if the age you know, time goes on and ages and becomes more mature, as we see some of the stems there, some of that rootstock can actually start to put out suckers, and that's the straight stems that you're seeing.

There is a process I believe it's called schooling, that it's a type of layering that you can use to with sawdust to suppress some of the newer growth that root stock and allow the curly sticks to grow to curly stems to grow.

Yeah, that's a process.

Yeah, and I didn't urge that viewer to really look into that process before they just take my take my word and throw some salt does.

Yeah, look into that.

Okay.

All right, question 60 This is from Logan McMinn and this is a longer one so bear with Why are my sky pencil Holly's dying?

The attached photos are of the last of the three Hollies I planted about 13 years ago, the other two died.

I replaced them and they seem to be doing fine after two seasons.

This one in the photo is about 13 years old.

I asked my nursery and they said it was winter kill.

I cut out the dead material.

But what you see in the photos has all developed since May, our sky pencil short lived and if I need to replace it with something more suitable to Central Illinois climate, what would you recommend?

I chose it because of its pronounced columnar habit and would like to have something similar.

I have seen some junipers least they think they're junipers would similar habit, but just not quite sure how tall they get and how hard it is to keep them short without becoming bushy, bushy.

So Logan really likes these and what are your thoughts?

Those are really cool.

The sky pencil Hollies are really neat plants.

Holly is a native to Illinois.

But of course the sky pencil is something that has been cultivated to grow here.

So again, sometimes those cultivated varieties aren't always as tried and true as some of our standard species.

In saying that, Hollies are also really can be finicky in terms of moisture, so maybe it gets too much rain in the spring, but then doesn't get enough rain in the summer.

And that will stress a holly out the PA, they prefer a certain pH as well.

And so if you fluctuate, not fluctuate, but if you stray too far from that preferred pH in your soils, that could be a contributing factor.

There could be something in you know going on in their yard that I have no idea about.

But those are just some of the factors that would play into these trees being in stress, you are doing the right thing by cutting out the dead branches that you see that's always a good practice.

In terms of replacement, if you find that you do have to replace it, I would really encourage you to plant native species.

And you can enter in your in your internet search engine, you know, Illinois native trees that I would always put like edu or extension on the end of that to make sure you're getting good quality information backed by science.

But I encourage native species.

And really, there are only a few evergreen species native to Illinois.

So you might be limited on that.

But there are several cultivated varieties of those standard species.

And that will still give that look that he's looking for.

Yeah, you know, depending on what you can find, or sometimes if you're looking for something really particular you might have to travel a little bit to find a nursery that that has that.

But I think there's plenty of options out there or you know, to look at some of those other native species in Illinois, they might find something that that you know, appeases their tastes even more.

Okay, you know, a lot of another thing i i don't water my trees.

I know, I know.

Shame on me.

Right?

But you just don't think about him when you've got the host are doing the flowers, you're taking care of the vegetables, but should we be watering even our mature established trees?

So the answer is it depends.

I love that.

Yeah.

Yeah, it depends.

Yes, certainly newly planted trees, we want to water those I mentioned adequate water at planting.

We want to we don't just want to put the hose full force on it and let it go.

You want some drip irrigation?

Or put it up, put the hose down to a trickle and let it go for a long time.

So we're really soaking saturating the soil.

I would, I would contend that it is a good thing to water those newly planted trees for at least a few years.

Those first few years are so crucial that yes, you should most certainly water them then mature trees.

If they're stressed already, and we've had droughty conditions, it can't hurt.

Gotcha.

Yep.

Okay.

Wow, great discussion.

I learned so much about trees today.

Thank you for coming to our tree talk.

If you have any other questions for Sarah or any of our other panelists about trees or plants, please send us an email to your garden@gmail.com or you can find us on Twitter, Instagram and Facebook.

Thank you so much for coming.

And thank you so much for watching, and we will see you next time.

Goodnight.